Jason Deaville - Ontario Metal
Ross Dolan - Bass/Vocals (Immolation)

What is it about Yonkers that has produced some of the most potent, disturbing, and exquisite Death Metal to ever grace our lonely little sphere? Is it reflective of the culture/lifestyle that comes with living in the urban sprawl that is New York? Could it be, more recently, the constant threat of terrorism that wreaks havoc on the psyche of its inhabitants? Well, whatever it is, Ross Dolan (bassist/vocalist) of Immolation, and his partners in brutality, have been affected ten-fold by it, and have released an album reflective of the current political situation abroad. Not a band to stick with the same old formula with each successive album, Immolation has moved away from the overtly anti-religious lyric's of the past.

"We've been doing the whole religion thing since about 1988" says Dolan. "There is only so much you can say and we feel we have said as much as we could without it becoming redundant." Harnessing Ruin, if you look close enough, contains some very subtle political hints. I ask Dolan to elaborate a little on this change in the lyrical approach. "Yeah, were really not a political band and, as you mentioned, it is very subtle. But mainly the focus is about what is happening in the world today. I don't want Immolation to become a political band, cause that's not what we are about. There was just some stuff that was weighing heavily on all of us since the election, and with the state that our country is now in. We try to write in a certain way that will allow fans to get different things out of each individual song. This time around I think our listeners will know exactly where we were going with this one." Harnessing Ruin's leadoff song 'Swarm of Terror', lyrically, is different from anything Immolation has ever done before. The song, to me, focuses on fear in the face of terror, which is something most Americans deal with on a daily basis. Is this what you were trying to convey? "Yeah, that was definitely in mind when we were writing it. In the past it was mainly myself writing the lyrics and Tom Wilkonson (former guitarist) had a lot of ideas. Tom hasn't been with us actively writing now for about two or three records. The last two records have been mainly Bob and myself, and I find it works out better that way because Bob has a lot of cool ideas that kind of work with what I am feeling. It worked out really good this time around. As far as input, we pretty much split it down the middle.'

Tom Wilkonson complimented Bob Vigna, the man behind Immolation's unique & chaotic songwriting, for many years. Ross explains how the songwriting process progressed this time around, now that Tom is no longer in the fold. "Bob pretty much wrote 90% of the music even when Tom was in the band. So, Bob has always been the main force in the band musically, and he still is. Tom contributed musically about 10% back then, but his strong points were his ideas lyrically. He would have a killer idea, which he would articulate to me in a certain way, and I would just take it from there. Tom was the idea man."

When a vocalist continually delivers great work album after album, it's very easy for us as fans to take their creativity and talent for granted. Yet Dolan consistently comes with catchy, clever and downright vocal lines to compliment one of the most unique guitarists in the metal genre, namely Bob Vigna. I ask the man if he finds it challenging working with such a king as Vigna. "No, not at all. Were like brothers. We are so on the same wavelength as to what we want and how we want things to go. We know right away when something is working and when it's not working." Is there ever a clash of personalities? "Well, once in a while, ya know? On this record I wasn't into the whole whispering vocal thing, and Bob was pretty adamant that I try it. I tried it, and realized that it wasn't that bad. It was only like 3 lines on the whole album. It's not like I'm up there doing some clean vocals (laughs). It was kinda like a dynamic thing, where we wanted the heavier vocals to come out stronger, and we felt that the whisper stuff would bring it out much better."

Another aspect of this album that really stands out from previous efforts, are the slightly odd production values, which create a very eerie/spooky vibe throughout, helping to elevate the bizarre melodies & atmosphere to unexplored heights. As Dolan explains, this is precisely what they were trying to achieve. "We definitely wanted to make it a more guitar heavy album. In the past we have always blended different guitar tones, between our live sound and all the sounds we try in the studio. With this one we went straight with what we use live, just our live gear. It was very stripped down, but it gave it a very big, warm, full sound. That was pretty much how we wanted it to be. We wanted it to be a very guitar heavy album, because the songs are a lot slower, a lot more mid-paced stuff that lends well to having that big, fat heavier guitar sound. We never can really plan how things work out because, obviously, when we are in the studio, it's not really our realm; it's the realm of the producer. We just like to get in there and play. We are not really big gear heads or anything like that. We just do what we have to do and hopefully the producer knows his stuff."

The enhanced cd version of Harnessing Ruin includes a video for the title track. Given the track record of most Death Metal videos, I wasn't expecting much with this one. Well, leave it to Immolation to once again prove that they are not your average, run-of-the-mill Death Metal Band. "This was definitely weird, cause there has never been any reason for us to do a video. With no outlet to showcase it, what would be the point? But now that Fuse, Uranium and the Headbangers Ball is back on MTV2, we felt it was the perfect time to do a video. It came out good and we are really happy with it. We didn't want to do something that was beyond our means, because we didn't really have much of a budget to work with. Were more of a live band, so we wanted to capture us in that live situation. The song is primarily about war, so we have those different little war clips that we wanted to throw in to tie it all together. It is very subtle, but it definitely brings the point home. Dolan explains the frustrations that come with working in this medium "We were in a room for like eight hours, just lip-synching and playing to the song. I wanted to have a mic stand, but the director didn't want it in the video, so I kind of felt like a jackass without it. We had to keep doing it over and over, and trying to make it look like you are into it one hundred percent was difficult itself. But when it was all said and done it turned out really good."

Immolation, as most fans know, are one of the forefathers of the original Death Metal movement. Releasing the much-heralded 'Dawn of Possession' on Roadrunner back in 1990. Yet, Immolation never quite broke-through like bands such as Deicide or Obituary. I ask Dolan if he felt his band was simply lost in the shuffle, along with other innovative bands of the time such as Gorguts "Yeah, without a doubt. We didn't even take that whole thing with Roadrunner seriously. We were just putting out demos & Roadrunner contacted us saying that they were interested in Immolation, and we didn't believe it. What would they want with a band like us? But they were serious, so ultimately we signed with them. We thought at that time it was the coolest thing that could ever happen to us. Roadrunner was an established label, even back then. So, when we signed that deal, we were very ecstatic. But within three months we were totally disillusioned. They ended up signing a slew of bands after us and we totally got lost in the shuffle. I'm sure if you were to talk to Luc (Lemay) of Gorguts he would throw some bitterness into the mix as well (laughs). It kinda happened for a good reason though, cause we learned right from the beginning that if we are going to achieve anything, it's going to have to be on our own merits. We thought by signing to a label that things were gonna start happening, but we found out that it's just not the case. You still have to work hard, if not harder. So that pretty much prepared us for the long, long, hard road ahead." Which lead me into my next question, what do you attribute your longevity to? "Probably cause were idiots (laughs). No, but really, we are very passionate about what we do. It's the one thing in all our lives, and I can speak for the other guys too, that we all really enjoy doing. We have never made a living off of the band, so we have been realistic since day one. Were in a better position now. At least when we tour, we can make enough money to sustain ourselves when we are away. The older you get the harder it is. We all work full time jobs. I have my own business & Bob works like seven days a week. Being based in New York, the cost of living is so high, you have to be very selective in the kind of tours you do." I ask Dolan what sold him on this particular tour "We were really waiting to see if we were going to do a headlining thing, but we really wanted to do a support tour because we feel like we still needed something more to bring us to that next level. Were still not quite their yet, at least that's how we feel. We could do the headlining thing, but we would likely play to half the amount of people that we are going to play to on this tour. We have never toured with Deicide before, so we definitely wanted to do it. It's a good situation for us, because we are not at that top spot, so it's like the burden is not all on us. Basically, we can have more fun on this tour."

This tour, pitting the old-school (Deicide, Immolation) against the new-school (Skinless, Despised Icon) is the perfect opportunity for Immolation to showcase their music to those in attendance who may not be familiar with your brand of extremity and vice-versa. "Definitely. I think tours like this work really good because it's not like we are all very different in styles; we are all still very extreme, just in different ends of the spectrum. It's really kind of cool. You get all these different kinds of kids who would not normally go out to see Deicide or us, and it works out good for everybody in the end."

I mention to Ross the one thing that bothers me most about being a devout follower of Death Metal, which is the lack of support or interest from some of the old-school fans of the genre. What I mean is, it seems that people latch onto this style of music at an early age & then seemingly disappear. Nothing irks me more than hearing a former fan say 'yeah, I used to listen to that stuff, but I have grown out of it.' I understand that a person's tastes can change over time, but if you are truly Death Metal, you are Death Metal for life. "Well it's definitely a style of music that appeals to the younger generations," adds Dolan. "When I was younger, I was fanatical about metal. Back then you really had to search to find bands. You had to actually write to the bands. There was no Internet or anything like that. You had to buy the black & white fanzines and thoroughly research the bands, and then order the demo for three bucks, wait a week or two for it to arrive, and hope it wasn't a turd. Now it's different. Kids are too spoiled. They have everything at their fingertips. They download shit before it's even out. I don't think it's healthy for the scene. There is something more satisfying if you find it yourself. Kids don't even want to leave their homes anymore. They don't really come out to the shows, which is not what the music is about in the first place." Do you find that some of the old guard are still coming out to the shows? "It depends. Like in New York I still see a lot of the old timers come out. But I understand if they don't. It's kind of hard to keep up on things. I have friends of mine who are in their mid-thirties who still like the old stuff, but don't know any of the new stuff, because they don't have the time. Really, you hear what you hear from your friends, and if the guys you hangout with aren't into it, you kind of slowly get out of it. I mean, I'm in it. I play the music and I'm involved in it on a different level, so of course I am in it in a different way." So, what's been gracing Ross Dolan's ears as of late? "I listen to everything, man. I like jazz, blues, and obviously I like metal. I like old Priest & Maiden, stuff like that. I like to keep my options open."

We switch gears a little bit, and discuss Immolation's appearance at this year's Maryland Deathfest. For those of you in attendance, you might have noticed some technical difficulties during Immolation's set. "The power went out twice during our set," explains Dolan. "It was some bullshit with one of the plugs going into the main-board that kept coming loose." I then ask Dolan about that night's set list, in which they excluded material from their 'Here In After' masterpiece. "I think we are only playing one song for that on this tour, which is Nailed In Gold," interjects Dolan. "It's just with that night in particular, we might have wanted to play more from it, but it's just the power thing kept funneling. We decided to nip it in the bud, and go out gracefully" (laughs). Dolan goes on to explain, "One thing people have to understand, is that were here because of the new record. Were all more excited about the new stuff. We have been playing the 'Dawn of Possession' and 'Here In After' stuff since that time. I personally don't want to play much of that shit anymore. Some of those songs we have been playing since '88. I don't want to be that band that relies on those old songs to get the crowd going. I think the new stuff is strong enough to carry us, and that's what we have been building on with this tour, mostly new shit. But like I said, we still have at least two songs off all the previous albums in rotation. So, your not gonna hear them all, cause we only have 40mins on the tour."

Like Immolation, Incantation have been brutalizing the Death Metal masses over the last two decades. In fact, for a short while before Bill came into the picture, John McEntee shared the stage with Immolation. Was there ever a chance of John coming into Immolation fulltime? "Yeah, there was a good chance. He knew that the door was open if he wanted to make the move. But he has Incantation, so I can understand why he didn't want to do it. We did one tour for the Failures album as a 3 piece, which was a little weird for us not having that second guitarist. But then we had John when we went to Europe. It was cool to have him in, cause we have been friends with John since we started in '88. Actually, our first show was with John's band at the time, Revenant. So, to have him help out and give us a hand like that was cool. He was just happy with the fact that he didn't have to deal with the bullshit of his own band, and watch Bob and I stress for a month," laughingly say's Dolan.

For many the recording process is very difficult, but Immolation always seems to release a tight, polished and massive sounding album. Even classics such as 'Dawn of Possession' and 'Unholy Cult' stand the test of time. Dolan explains how this was achieved, "Dawn of Possession is totally different because that was our first record. We worked with Harris Johns for that album. Harris had worked with such bands as Sodom, Kreator and Voivod, all the bands that we grew up listening to. So, it was very exciting for us to work with such a legendary producer. We actually had the choice of working with Harris, Colin Richardson or Scott Burns." So, wouldn't the safest choice at that time have been Scott Burns? "No, we never really wanted to use Scotty, not that there is anything wrong with him," corrects Dolan. "It's just that at the time it seemed to be the in thing to do. We just wanted to do our own thing, dance to our own beat, and do a little something different. Immolation is not about following trends. We are happy we did choose Harris, because the album has a totally different sound than anything else. As far as what went into making that album, it was totally different than what made every record after that. Because it was our first record, we had so much time to write these songs, craft them and get them ready. When we went into the studio we had already played these songs a million times. For us there was really no work involved. All we had to do was show up and play the songs as we knew how to play them. We were young and we didn't know anything about the studio. Now, we play to a click track in the studio to keep things in time, but back then we threw caution to the wind. We didn't even know what we were tuned to. All we knew was that we were tuned together, but we didn't know we were tuned to C. Harris asked us what do you guys tune to? And we told him that we tune to Bob. That's how retarded we were back then," laughs Dolan. "Every record after that was a little more difficult, cause now we had a timeline. We had to come up with stuff. The label wanted material to be out at a specific time, and you had to force yourself to get things done on time." Did Roadrunner heap a ton of pressure on you guys? "There was pressure for the second record. After we saw how things went for the first record, we really didn't want to do the second one with them. So, we went to Roadrunner and told them that we were unhappy, and felt that they weren't going to do what we needed done for us. In the end, they just let us go. We actually had signed a 7 record contract with them. They were real cool about it. I think they knew that they weren't going to be doing anything for us. So, it was just better for both parties."

Often we know nothing about the musicians themselves - so I ask Dolan to introduce us to the man outside of Immolation. "Well, I am single. I stay pretty much to myself. I am just a normal hard-working guy. I have my own business, and I have a second job. So, obviously I am a different person when I am up there on stage. I'm kind of forced to be more outgoing. I'm the kind of guy who just likes disappearing into the crowd. Back home, most people don't even know what I do. With my business I have a lot of accounts and clients, and none of them know what I do. I'm not one of these guys who tells everyone that I am in a band. I hate that kinda shit, it's so gay. I like to keep my life with the band separate from my home life." Metal is something personal. Something very deep that is hard to share with just the average person. "Yeah, that is definitely true," agrees Dolan. "People just don't understand. They don't understand the dedication. Twenty years of my life has been given to this band. So, people can't even grasp that. The closest the average person can come to understanding it, is to compare it to people who are into sports. You know how some guys are really into their sports, watch the games everyday and follow it religiously. It's similar to how we are with our music. It's the only thing I can equate it to. But other than that, I am really tight with my family. I hangout with my mom, aunt and my uncle, and Bob and I hangout a lot too. A big night out for me is dinner and a movie."

In closing - I ask Dolan what the future holds for Immolation. As fans, are we going to be able to enjoy more albums into our elderly years? "Were going to do this as long as we can physically handle it (laughs). I mean, at my age (36) I still enjoy this stuff. I'm still like a little kid. Age means nothing; it's a state of mind really. If you feel old and decrepit, then that's how you are gonna be. But metal is definitely a young person's music, no doubt about it. I've always been one of these guys that keeps an open-mind with music, even when I was younger. But even now, more so, I appreciate other styles of music. I appreciate other types of shows as well. I like that musical element of seeing what other guys are doing. I mean, I kinda live this music everyday so to speak. I know what this is about. We have played with pretty much every Death Metal band that there is. We see them all performing and these are some of the best musicians out there, and they never get the credit they deserve. But it's also cool to go out and see a jazz show, or a blues show, just to see the passion that pours out of these guys. To see one guy on stage with just a guitar and a harmonica, and just going for it is impressive too. It's cool to appreciate something like that. They are on the same level as us, it's just that they are playing something totally different, I love that."